Flag Pin for Palestine

technoalpha

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#1
I believe that the Palestinian flag should be added to the Asia 2 flag bundle. I will lay out my reasons below:

1. Relevance: As most people will know, there is a long-standing conflict over the political and humanitarian recognition of Palestine as a sovereign nation. Over the past 6+ months, an Israeli offensive of historic proportions has caused massive civilian deaths in the Gaza strip, acts which the overwhelming majority of human rights' charities, experts on war and genocide, and civilians on the ground have identified as war crimes with possible genocidal intent. It is therefore unsurprising that huge swathes of the populations of many nations have the desire to express solidarity with the Palestinian people, and the flag of that nation is the most direct way to do so. Of course, there are also many people who support the Israeli government's narrative of the conflict as a legal and defensible action. Because the Israeli flag pin is already present in the Asia 2 flag bundle, I feel that there is an imbalance in representation.

2. Precedent: There is a notable absence of the Russian flag in any of the flag pin bundles, and an emphasis of the Ukrainian flag at the top of the Europe bundle and as the icon for that bundle. I hazard to guess that this emphasis dates back to the Russian invasion of Ukraine in 2022, in which case there is a precedent of allowing flag pins as a form of political speech by players. I note that despite the war in Ukraine being significantly longer than the potential genocide in Gaza, more than three times as many civilians have been killed in Gaza at the time of writing (and those are documented ones alone, likely an underestimate).

3. Geography: There are several countries represented by flag pins which have smaller populations or smaller land areas than Palestine, so I can only assume that relevance/requests are the main criteria.

Please let players show their support for Palestine in about the most chill way imagineable -- a flag pin! :)
 

StinkyCat

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#3
Agreed, this is so relevant to our time and I would love to show my solidarity with my friends and family :)
 
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JASO0ON

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#5
I believe that the Palestinian flag should be added to the Asia 2 flag bundle. I will lay out my reasons below:

1. Relevance: As most people will know, there is a long-standing conflict over the political and humanitarian recognition of Palestine as a sovereign nation. Over the past 6+ months, an Israeli offensive of historic proportions has caused massive civilian deaths in the Gaza strip, acts which the overwhelming majority of human rights' charities, experts on war and genocide, and civilians on the ground have identified as war crimes with possible genocidal intent. It is therefore unsurprising that huge swathes of the populations of many nations have the desire to express solidarity with the Palestinian people, and the flag of that nation is the most direct way to do so. Of course, there are also many people who support the Israeli government's narrative of the conflict as a legal and defensible action. Because the Israeli flag pin is already present in the Asia 2 flag bundle, I feel that there is an imbalance in representation.

2. Precedent: There is a notable absence of the Russian flag in any of the flag pin bundles, and an emphasis of the Ukrainian flag at the top of the Europe bundle and as the icon for that bundle. I hazard to guess that this emphasis dates back to the Russian invasion of Ukraine in 2022, in which case there is a precedent of allowing flag pins as a form of political speech by players. I note that despite the war in Ukraine being significantly longer than the potential genocide in Gaza, more than three times as many civilians have been killed in Gaza at the time of writing (and those are documented ones alone, likely an underestimate).

3. Geography: There are several countries represented by flag pins which have smaller populations or smaller land areas than Palestine, so I can only assume that relevance/requests are the main criteria.

Please let players show their support for Palestine in about the most chill way imagineable -- a flag pin! :)
I agree, but I think it would be a bit controversial for Manacube to add it atm
 

sophiaaah <3

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#7
They have isreal so what’s the controversy With now adding palestine?
The issue with adding it is that the Israel one was there prior to the rise in conflict. I believe that being inclusive, raising awareness and support is important but people can be pretty polarizing so adding it in could cause people to be targeted more with hate crimes or really anything because people be crazy.
Please let players show their support for Palestine in about the most chill way imagineable -- a flag pin!
I don't think there is ever going to be a chill way to show support because this conflict is very dividing for really anyone and it might stir up more issues than intended which is more work in the long run.

I want to add, I'm not taking sides. I've seen through my own personal experience and others how rude, disgusting, and vile some players , or even anyone can be and it's probably better to avoid that conflict. It doesn't affect me in anyway if this idea goes through or not but there are pros and cons to anything
 

technoalpha

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#8
The issue with adding it is that the Israel one was there prior to the rise in conflict. I believe that being inclusive, raising awareness and support is important but people can be pretty polarizing so adding it in could cause people to be targeted more with hate crimes or really anything because people be crazy.

I don't think there is ever going to be a chill way to show support because this conflict is very dividing for really anyone and it might stir up more issues than intended which is more work in the long run.
I see your perspective, it's valid to want to keep division off the server as much as possible. I personally would rather err on the side of letting people express themselves in small ways like pins, and hope that the existing rules against hate speech or excessive rudeness in chat will still be applied consistently.

However, if the call by the admins is to keep division off the server by excluding certain flags, I think it's very important that that call be applied consistently. For example, if the rule is that nations involved in major conflicts should not be represented with flags on the server, then obviously both the Israeli and Ukraine flags should be removed (Russia already being absent). But, this will of course set a precedent. Will the US flag be removed from the flag pins list if it conducts an invasion of Iran a few years down the line, or the Chinese flag if China invades Taiwan? I suspect the answer to both questions is no.

So, I circle back to believing the simplest way for the admins to avoid making tricky political decisions every time a war happens, is to just represent all nations as anyone requests them.
 

StinkyCat

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#9
I see your perspective, it's valid to want to keep division off the server as much as possible. I personally would rather err on the side of letting people express themselves in small ways like pins, and hope that the existing rules against hate speech or excessive rudeness in chat will still be applied consistently.

However, if the call by the admins is to keep division off the server by excluding certain flags, I think it's very important that that call be applied consistently. For example, if the rule is that nations involved in major conflicts should not be represented with flags on the server, then obviously both the Israeli and Ukraine flags should be removed (Russia already being absent). But, this will of course set a precedent. Will the US flag be removed from the flag pins list if it conducts an invasion of Iran a few years down the line, or the Chinese flag if China invades Taiwan? I suspect the answer to both questions is no.

So, I circle back to believing the simplest way for the admins to avoid making tricky political decisions every time a war happens, is to just represent all nations as anyone requests them.
I think this was extremely well said. And if the servers want to be even more diplomatic, they could add more Arab-states (Egypt, UAE, etc)
 

sophiaaah <3

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#10
Ukraine flags should be removed (Russia already being absent)
I see your point of view and agree with everything you had to say, but i don't think the war in ukraine is comparable to whats happening in palestine. Both are occuring for different reasons with different effects.